30 Kasım 2008 Pazar

Predetermination-or are our lives in our own hands?

Remember that Shakespeare was a humanist and believed that humans had a certain amount of responsibility for the way their lives turned out. In medieaval Europe, however, it was believed that the events in human life were predetermined, and that people's fates depended on the stars.
In his play "Romeo and Juliet", there is much mention of the stars and fate - "star-cross'd lovers", "I am fortunes fool", and "I defy you stars" are just some examples. However, what evidence is there in the play that Shakespeare thought that people brought their own downcomes upon themselves?

20 yorum:

gamze koç dedi ki...

From the very begginning of the play we know that fate is an important factor that determines the Romeo and Juliet's life.However Shakespere is known a hmanistic poet and and why he incluses the fate so much in their works .When we examine Romeo and J uliet we can say that maybe they can not come together because they were accepted that it is the fate that gives a way to their lives and they do nothing for their love and theyy choose death in the and .I have mentioned that Shakespere is a humanist ,
and perhaps Shakespeare is expressing his own views about human free will, as opposed to fatalism or a belief in divine predestination, when Edmund remarks in King Lea:

“This is the excellent foppery of the world, that, when we are sick in fortune – often the surfeit of our own behaviour – we make guilty of our disasters the sun, the moon, the stars… as if we were fools by heavenly compulsion…and all that we were evil in, by a divine thrusting on.”

Altough Shakespere focuses on the fate very much it is their own choice in the end that romeo and Juliet kill themselves.
In Elizabethan age The Christian view of suicide, that it was a great sin .We can conclude that altough it is fate taht is dominant topic throughout play ,it is their own choice that gives an end to play.

Elif Gülay dedi ki...

Predeterminism is leading the story from the very beginning to the end.One of the most obvious proof of it is displayed in the prologue part before the actual story begins.In this prologue, as we know, a kind of summary of the play is written by saying what is going to happen in the end of it. It indicates that Romeo and Juliet's fate are predetermined, and nobody can change it.

However, in the play we can see how Romeo and Juliet rebel against their unlucky destiny even if it results in their death. Also, it is such an irony that in the play Romeo is given some chances to change this terrible end.For example, if Romeo was able to control himself and did not kill Tybalt, he wouldn't be exiled. Perhaps by this way, they could bring their families the peace with the help of their secret marriage. Also, Romeo could be more conscious to see that Juliet is alive, before drinking the potion in Juliet's tomb. Actually he says that Juliet is like alive, but he does not understand the reason behind it. This was second chance for their love and life, but Romeo wasted both of them because of his uncontrolled behaviours.

That's why we can say that the person who is responsible for this terrible end is Romeo, on the other hand, maybe they are the stars which urge Romeo to act so,who knows?

gülhanozdemirorg dedi ki...

From the very beginning of the play, predeterminism is focused on. In the prologue, for instance, Romeo and Juliet are mentioned as star-crossed lovers. Also throughout the play, we can encounter the examples of it. If Romeo had waited a few minutes more before he killed himself, they wouldn’t have to separate from on another. Or if Juliet had persuaded her parents to postpone her wedding to a few days later, everything would have gone well. However, whatever they did, the end of Romeo and Juliet would be the same because it is their fate and this cannot be hindered.

Merve Coşkun dedi ki...

Throughout the play,we can see that predetermination is a major factor affecting characters' life to a great extent.The mechanism of fate works in all of the events surrounding the lovers.However,the play gives us a sense that lovers' lives actually are in their hands.Things would have been different;if Romeo hadn't been enraged by the Tybalt's killing Mercutio or if he hadn't taken the poison to kill himself.If we look at the events from the Juliet's view;we can say that if she had been brave to tell her family about Romeo, again things would have turned out in a different way.So we can say that Shakespeare creates a sense of fate which can be controlled by individuals.

YONCA dedi ki...

Although we always mention both the lovers' fate is predetermined, we have some responsibilities in changing our fates. For example, Romeo could have avoided fighting Tybalt,and thus not have been exiled.But Romeo decided to kill Tybalt. In my opinion, fate is what we are doing, thus it is in our hands. There is a famous Turkish saying "Eşeğini sağlam kazığa bağla, gerisini Allah'a bırak", which fits best here. If we don't do anything to change our way of thinking or accept any bad result and live ignoring its consequences, is it possible really to say we cannot change our fate? No...

melike dedi ki...

If it is a question, we need to question ourselves. I believe if you believe something,it prepares your end; or if you do not believe then you become the arhticecture of your own lives.
I resemble the life to our test.Teacher minimize the options to 5 and students are to choose the which suit themselves.In life,teacher replaces with God and students are the same but this time every living things are students...

merveb dedi ki...

Some people say that they are not in control of their lives, so they aren't responsible for what happens. However, I am sure that, we are in charge of our actions. So, I believe that it is possible to change fate. In Shakespeare's tragedy, the prologue points out that Romeo and Juliet have fate against them. They have no control over what happens. This whole play revolves around fate. In my opinion, from the beginning, Romeo acts without thinking of the consequences. For instance, Romeo should not have gone to the party because he knows Capulet is his enemy. Moreover, Romeo kills Tybalt out of rage although he knows it makes things all the worse for his current situation with Juliet. Also, before Romeo drinks the poison immediately, he should have learnt the reason of Juliet’s death. I belive that Romeo and Juliet choose their own fate when they take the actions of killing themselves. As said by William Shakespeare "It is not in the stars to hold our destiny but in ourselves." Finally, I strongly believe that Romeo and Juliet would have a happy end if they realized they were free to influence their destiny.

sevdeyor dedi ki...

Stars and fate are the most important factors in the play. as we know that the story begins with a prologue telling that Romeo and Juliet are star-crost lovers. Finally, it finishes with the bad fate. In my opinion, the last of the story focuses on the power of fate. It is believed that the events in human life were predetermined and the fate is the most important thing for the future of human being. During the play we see some irony, unexpected events or changes in the situations and feelings but it finishes in the way what the stars want. I believe the power of the fate, but at the same time I believe in the power of human being. If we want to change the end of the situations, we do. Besides, if Juliet had told her family about the love with Romeo, the end would have changed. However, Shakespeare believes the fate even though there is a sense of fate which can be controlled by us.

gamzeuzun dedi ki...

through the play, ı see fate in each scene.romeo and juliet's life depends on fate and stars.romeo and juliet's meeting and their deaths.for instance, ıf romeo hadn't gone to the party he wouldn't come across with juliet.ın fact our lives are in our hands.maybe there can be some certain situations but to
make them real depends on us.ıf we dont want, fate is nothing itself.in the play there are a lot
examples about it. fate starts the events and they continue it to the way they want.

meryem arslanaydin dedi ki...

Predermination is a major factor shaping the whole story from the begining to the end. However,that does not mean Romeo and Juliet had no responsibility for the way their lives turned out. First of all Romeo's gatecrashing to the party and falling in love at first sight is an important example of predeterminism. In the play gatecrashing to the party is just to see Rosaline,but he meets Juliet and loves her ,and they kiss each other even if they don't know each other which shows that their meeting and passionate love is predetermined in spite of their parents' feuding. Moreover,the fact taht Friar Lawrence's letter explaining the plan for their reuniting to Romeo never reaches Mantua is another evidence of predeterminism. Friar John who is the bearer of the letter is confined to a quarantined house because of the plague disease,so Romeo hears only that Juliet is dead. If the message reached Romeo They would go and have the chance to spend their life together.However,there are some events that they had the responsibility of the way their lives turned out,for example if Romeo didn't kill Tybalt,he wouldn't be exiled and they would live happily by escaping. He would be more patient and not kill Tybalt. Finally most of the events seem to be predetermined; even if they tried to change their unlucky fates,they couldn't help but they lived what is predetermined by their unlucky fates.

neslihan dedi ki...

while we are reading the play,we see that fate controls the life of the people, but according to Shakespeare, an humanist writer, the lifes of the peple are in their own hands. For instance, if Romeo was able to control himself and did not kill Tybalt, he wouldn't be exiled. and maybe this situation brings peace to the two families. also, after they fall in love , they always believe that they cannot be together, they never believe that their families reconcile, so this thought prepares their end, but we see that after they died their families make peace. at the same time, if they had not thought to kill themselves, they would have been together. I mean that they always thought the worst thing and their negative thoughts results with tragic ends.

gussum dedi ki...

It is the fact that everyone has a fate, and some future facts are inevitable for them. However, every person has an ability to think and imagine what might happen at the end of their decisions. I believe that, fate is a fact, but it is possible to make some changes by using correctly what is suggested. A correct and a wrong way are suggested, and we are supposed to find and choose the correct one by using our mind. Therefore, something bad happens at the end when we choose the wrong one, we are responsible for our own mistakes, that is, it is our fault. On the other hand, if we choose the correct way and good things happen, we are the heroes and the heroines for our each success. To sum up, it is important to be able to think correctly and then decide logically instead of accepting something in our fate. In the play, predetermination is dominant, but there are some opportunities for Romeo and Juliet to change their fate. I think, Romeo and Juliet should have tried to find other ways to come together. At first, it seems that they fight against their misfortune by trying to be together due to the family feud, but through the end, they prepare their own tragic end. They should have not decided quickly what they did because they could find some ways to live together without any feud.

enminenurdan dedi ki...

Throughout the play, ıt is depicted that the fate has a control over the characters and the life of them. However, ı strongly believe that the fates of people are in their hands. If Romeo stoped himself and din not kill Juliet’s cousin then, he would not be exiled. So he woul be aware of Juliet’s drinking sleeping poison and would not want to kill himself.Lastly, they could be together. Morover, ıf juliet had told her father that she loves Romeo, then her father might have understood her and let them be together. Finally, we deduce from all these that we control our fate rather than our fate contols us.

aytul dedi ki...

This whole play revolves around fate from the beginnig of it, but as said by William Shakespeare in Julius Caesar, "It is not in the stars to hold our destiny but in ourselves." From the beginning, Romeo acts without thinking of the consequences. For example, when a Capulet servant asks for a list of invited people for a party to be read out, Romeo reads it out, but decides to go to the party himself; knowing Capulet is his enemy. Secondly, Romeo kills Tybalt out of rage, even though he knows it makes things all the worse for his current situation with Tybalt's cousin, Juliet. After Romeo kills Tybalt, he grieves his mistake by saying, "O, I am fortune's fool!". Lastly, if Romeo had just taken some time to say prayers or thought about what he was doing before he resorted to suicide, he could have been in the tomb in time for the Friar to arrive and explain everything. All of these reasons explicitly shows that it is our fate and it is in our hands, everything in our life is a matter of choice.

damlaoktem dedi ki...

We have the control of our lives. Maybe there are the things we cannot control in our lives, but I believe that we are in charge of most of our actions. In the play, prologue and some quotations points out that the events are not in the control of the characters, but Romeo would change his destiny if he was not the victim of his anger, hothead.

aysun ören dedi ki...

There is no doubt that our fate is predetermined before our birth, but of course the choices we make draw our ways in life. In this play, this situation is revealed in a best way by Shakespeare. Throughout the play, we can see the fate because the mechanism of fate works in all of the events surrounding the lovers. However, the fate is somehow in our hands as it is in Romeo and Juliet’s hands in the play because thare are many turning points in the play that would change their fate if they acted differently. For instance, if Romeo didn’t kill Tybalt, he would not be exiled and their end would come differently or if Juliet could think more reasonably rather than thinking emotionally and hopelessly, and told her parents about Romeo, her father would be convinced and she would not be a part of their fatal plan. These are just a few examples of the characters’ influence on their fate in the play. Consequently, I can say that although our destiny is predetermined, our personality and the way we choose to live or the way we react to different events throughout our life shape our fate considerably as it is in Romeo and Juliet.

rabis dedi ki...

The power of fate is introduced in the Prologue.Predeterminisim is obvious from the beginning of the play because Romeo and Juliet are introduced as star-crossed.In addition, fate is the biggest force opposing Romeo and Julietlovers.However, they are given chance to change their own fate.For example,Juliet decides to drink the potion in order not to marry Paris.She is really determined not to marry him and change her fate a bit.Another example of it can be seen in Romeo's decision especially when he cant control his anger and as a result he goes to Mantua.Finally, I can say that fate is the force that predetermines events but,they bring their own downcomes upon themselves with the limitation of the fate.

didem dedi ki...

Predetermination is the belief that all events that occur in life have already been determined by a higher power.Usually when we make a big mistake we try to find sb to blame and predetermination pops up at that point. We blame faith and other powers. However if there is no problem, we do not try to find anybody to complain. In this play if everything was going properly, it would not be a very famous play. Their love, their families feud, their emotions were all clearly defined and reflected in the script. No matter how much you try to change your faith, you change only the route of fate. If sth is going to be happen, it happens.

Çi dedi ki...

fate is the way that God shows, yet the one to be chosen is what we are responsible for. In this play, Romeo would have fought against his fortune. He wouldn't have killed Tybalt, he wouldn't have committed suicide immediately without asking to Friar Lawrence or without being sure whether his love passed away. Shakespeare tries to highlight these 'would have been's. Romeo was fortune's fool since he did everything without questioning. He never thought twice. Today, we may be on the way to be the fortune's fool or to draw the line with our own hands. The way ,the fate, is put in front of the humankind by God it is determined by ourselves.

veli dedi ki...

we understand from the very beginnig, in the prologue, that predeterminism is leading this story. "two star-crossed lovers take their life", show us that their fate is predetermined beforehand. this quotation also shows us that fate is a dominant factor in the play. Before the end of the play, Romeo couln't get the letter, so when he found his lover he thought she was really dead and he killed himself.